Note from the Webmaster: Normally, I use this space for a real conversation—an exciting email debate that SKS is having about something or other. You can read one of those here. But this month we got a series of emails from a girl in Hong Kong, and these messages were so moving that I thought I would post them here instead, along with my replies to her (I get the forms that people send in from the Web site). Other than the girl's name (which is not actually "Betsy") and a bit of minor editing that she requested (punctuation and grammar details, not content), what follows is the exact conversation we had.

Hi,

Well, I have so much to say, and it seems not enough time. Not enough time to say it all, and not enough time to get this feeling of angst out of me to convey how anxious I am to know more about SKS.

I have just finished my studies and I have taken my first year of work abroad in Hong Kong (I am from Australia originally). After going through your website, work seems to have taken a bit of second priority this week, but I feel like it is just one of those things that I cannot seem to get enough of and I just want to know more.

I have found your website to have so many answers for myself at this point in time and I would buy a ticket to the States now if I could just to attend a seminar and to be asked the right questions that will break down some of the walls I have put up in my short time on this earth. Questions that will lead to tears, release, and more importantly...truth.

Can I please ask for your assistance now? What can I do from such a distance to get those granules of truth I have been searching for, for some time now, that will start to make things easier? I guess what I am asking is: how do I know myself and face myself when I just cannot seem to knock down these walls without, it seems, the external help of others?

Like I said, so much to write and just not enough time to do it. Any suggestions would be so lovingly appreciated.

Yours in faith,
Betsy

Betsy,

How wonderful to hear from you! It sounds like you really "get it"—just from reading the Web site, you understand so much about what we're about and what we're doing.

I certainly understand your frustration. I felt the same way when, after several years in SKS, I moved to Seattle. I knew I needed a spiritual community—people who would get to know me, who would challenge me, who would support me and remind me of what was important. I had known such a community. And now I was in Seattle, and I didn't know a soul.

Here are some things I did.

• I got a bunch of SKS tapes and listened to them in the car. At the risk of sounding self-promotional, I do want to suggest that you check out our "Order Page" and consider ordering Augie Turak's "Five Years with a Zen Master" tape, or Dave Gold's "After the Absolute" book. For the most part, these books won't teach you anything you don't already know. But at their best, they will inspire you, excite you, remind you what is important. It's so easy to forget.
• I checked out local spiritual groups. Not knowing what else to do, I opened up the phone book and started calling everybody: Christian, Hindu, New Age, secular philosophical, anything that looked like it might be relevant. (This was in the days before the Web.) I found a number of groups that had something to teach me, and good people I could learn from.
• Eventually I started my own group. This was terrifying, because I'm a very introverted person. But I put up posters all over town advertising a philosophical/spiritual discussion group, met with prospects, and held weekly meetings at my house. I was not a good group leader. In six months, I whittled a group of 30 down to 2. But it was one of the most intense and educational experiences I've ever had in my life.

-Kenny Felder
Webmaster, Self Knowledge Symposium
http://www.selfknowledge.org

Kenny,

Thank you so much for your prompt reply and sound words of advice. Your email really found some resonance. I would like to take this chance to communicate with you on a few things you pointed out.

I appreciate you letting me know about the SKS tapes (and I am glad that you mentioned the self-promotional part). I agree with your point that it may not necessarily teach you anything new, but the point is the inspiring and exciting messages and the reiteration of things we so often forget. I cannot tell you how much I agree with what you have just said, Kenny. Thank you.

Receiving your email was gave me a feeling of "petrified excitement." It was like receiving your university entrance exam results—you are so petrified that you cannot open the envelope when it is right there in your hands. Yes, it did take me about 10 minutes to open the email.

I was raised in a Catholic home, and during university I had a few encounters with born again Christians, who proceeded to drum into my head that following any other religion is a one way track to hell. This frightened me and stunted my spiritual growth in a big way; I closed myself off from so many loving techniques because I was so frightened all the time. Thankfully, finding other friendships and great music such as Michael Franti, I am starting to pull some of those walls down. But I just want these walls to come down more quickly, and I don't want to be strangled by them any more...to live, and not waste my time, and as SKS says, live deliberately. I'm not sure if you are getting this. And SKS also makes a lot of sense to me in terms of depression. Working on yourself from the inside out, rather than relying on chemical supplements for numbed happiness.

I'm planning to go check out some temples around Hong Kong, because some of them are pretty amazing from what friends have told me. Not to mention, get some of those tapes.

Kenny, I cannot thank you enough!

Warm Regards,
Betsy

Have you read much Mark Twain? I'm always struck by the impression that, early in his life, he intellectually discarded the Christianity he was brought up with. But emotionally, it never let go. He spent his whole life debunking it again and again.

Like Twain, I was brought up in the SouthEast corner of the United States. It's a region which is often refered to simply as "the South" or as "dixie" but Twain gave it another name: "the Bible Belt." He did not mean it as a compliment. It is Fundamentalist Bible-Thumping Hell-and-Damnation Central for the entire United States. I grew up across the street from a wonderful, nice family who were convinced that my family and I were all damned eternally for being Jewish. (I never became Christian, but I eventually lost touch with Judaism as well.)

So, OK, what's my point? Just this: a lot of people I know are sort of modern-day Mark Twains, bitter and bent out of shape. That is probably a necessary phase, but make sure it doesn't become more than that. At this point in my life, I have a tremendous amount of compassion and respect for the fundamentalist Christians. I respect the fact that they are focused on the "big questions"--it's a big step up from spending your whole life in the quest for digital TV. And I respect the fact that they are genuinely trying to do good, as they understand it, to save people like you and me from grisly torment.

So, ironically, "forgiving" the Christians may be one of the important steps in pulling down your walls. Or it may not, what do I know? But I thought I'd mention it.

-k

Hey Kenny,

Cheers again for your much appreciated thoughts. You have done me a great favour, and you have confirmed my thoughts and the impression that I had about SKS. What I mean to say is that through your last email your thoughts have given me something else to think about, and given me a alternate way of viewing issues that appear to have been clouding my judgement.

I really enjoy your approach on certain issues. And this is what I enjoy the most: rather than choosing hatred, you simply choose love and are able to convincingly follow this choice because it is simply where truth and light reside. So as for your point, Kenny...well, here is mine. I think that before I can forgive others, I need to figure out why I did some of the things I did. I am probably speaking too abstractly now for you to really understand...sorry about that. Some of my past actions may be viewed as running away, but really—at the end of the day—only I can truly know "why" I did what I did, deep down inside. The answers lie there. If I can work on myself, be challenged with the right questions about myself, by not being afraid to ask them, then I can beat this. Kenny, I can beat this! Avoiding the trap of narcisissm, of course.

Again, thanks for your thoughts, and hope you don't mind me keeping you posted on things.

Sincerely,
Betsy

I am very, very much hoping you'll keep me posted on things. I feel the excitement of someone who has discovered a kindred soul very far away.

If you were in North Carolina—and certainly, very strongly, if you were in SKS—I would tell you that one of the first things to do is push past the abstractions and actually talk specifically about what happened, as abstractions are often another form of running away. As it is, I hope you are able to connect with people in Hong Kong who are like-minded enough that you can push past the abstractions with them, tell them the specifics, and then they can help you see things more clearly.

Best of luck!!!

-k

Well, I am not sure if this email is a little too premature, but I just feel like I have to touch base with someone. I receieved the package from SKS last week, and I have not been able to put any of the stuff down (After the Absolute, Augie Turak's lecture, Dave Gold's lecture "Thinking the Unthinkable"). The book by David Gold, though I have not finished it yet, is like having lightning bolts through my head, alleviating so much pressure in my mind. I think it is the first thing that has given me hope in ages, and I am really starting to get an accurate picture of the philosophy (Okay, tricky word to use, but the closest I could find) of what SKS is all about. Now, I don't consider myself that much of a reader at all, but with this book, I actually find myself with a pencil in hand, making notes all over it, just like a student who is really engrossed in what they are doing...needless to say, none of my University books had any notes on them, he-he-he.

Not to mention that the oddest things have been happening since I received this stuff and started really thinking about God and asking what it all means. It's almost as if each day I get some sign or message, but I am not sure at all what to do with this. For example, this girl asks me if I'm looking for a bus...and the next thing you know, we are talking about Christian Fellowships, and praying on the sidewalk in an effort to lift some of the pressure that just seems to be increasing and increasing (to which I wonder if it is indeed an entity, like the one Rose said those witches had...Gold's book, or indeed if this is just bullshit...ahhh). Then the very next night I am at a Dinner Party and one of my great friends is wearing a shirt saying "The Religious Right is Wrong," and this just spins me again, because in the past I have been very wary of Born Again Christians. Then the following day I am having this conversation with some clients at work, and this one lady looks me right in the eye and asks "Where do you get your answers from?" I reply, "I guess that comes down to every individual's personal philosophy or religion." And you know, I could just feel this one word in my head saying "GOD," but for fear of not wanting to go into that whole cliché—or because I was working—I just said that it was up to each individual to believe what they want.

So, Kenny, if you are still with me, when I get through this book, or indeed if I have any more dramas I feel I need to get down on paper in order to solicite some advice, hope it is okay to shoot you some things. I can't say that I am on my commitment to truth, because I think it is one hard thing, and I totally agree with the notion of "Clear away the bullshit." So I'm just going to get through the book first and then, well, we'll see.

Thanks Kenny for letting me bash this out,

Betsy

Betsy, this is just so inspirational for me. Augie once said that SKS, more than a philosophy or a religion, is a "tone"—a particular note—and some people just resonate to that frequency. Through the wonders of technology, you tuned into us from untold thousands of miles away and you caught the exact tone right away.

I would like to share this message with some of the other people in SKS, if you don't mind. I know they will be equally delighted.

-k

Oh, Kenny, that is just great. I was catching the underground today and, for the first time in days, did not feel like immediately taking out After the Absolute (it comes with me whereever I go at the moment). But then I just took it out, out of habit, and you know, it just pulled me right out of whereever I was and put me back into reality. It's great and I cannot thank you enough for your recommendations.

Sure you can read my 'thoughts' out, as scattered as they are.

Oh! And I totally get that tone you are talking about. From what I am understanding of Rose, that universe—truth leading to God—is nothing your mind can comprehend, hence leading to a tone. We cannot really understand what a tone is with the parameters of our mind. It's something a different part of you can recognise, and I am hoping that is your soul that knows. But my thoughts and understanding are very premature, so if you are not getting any of this, no bother at all.

Here's to technology, hey!!!

Cheers again Kenny,
Betsy

Hi Kenny,

Well I have finished the book, and it seems that the first thing which I have been anxious to do is get to work and send this email off to you. The last part of the book was so powerful I have been left somewhat a bit disoriented about where to go.

Where to start? The book was amazing...and I thank you so very much for the recomendation to read it. I just hope that I can hold onto the knowledge it has provided me with and grow from that knowledge, rather than letting it go to waste.

In the past few weeks while I have been reading it, it has just confirmed to me what I need to be seeking. But as Gold mentions...I am shit scared. There is no possible way I can guarantee that I will get any further on my path to the Truth than where I am now. But one thing is for certain, I cannot walk away from this. Because what else is there in life? I will not be happy walking away from this, and who knows what fate lies ahead of me if I do turn my back.

But really, I don't even think that I have a choice to turn my back on it, because EVERY SINGLE TIME that I do, something ALWAYS brings me back. It's as if there's a voice in my head, every time that I know that I am making a wrong decision—you know, like your intuition—but lacking in courage, I fail to take my intuition in hand and listen to it. Following this, my intution is confirmed by the result of my actions (that were against my intuition) being failure, in the eyes of the truth. I'm not sure if you got that. But if you look at David Gold, after his operation regarding the brain tumor, and all the clarity he saw regarding his actions in the past, elements of the truth of his being were realised then....yet when he went back to the farm with Rose, he carried on as normal, DESPITE all the recent clarity and imminent threat of death. Why is this just such a LONG process it seems for us humans??? Why can we not just surrender to the Truth??? Why are we so afraid??? And Kenny, I am just a mere mortal—nothing more, nothing less—and I am guilty of exactly the same thing as Gold. Of getting a glimpse of the truth and continuing to indulge in ridiculous behaviour! The frustration of being Human!!! The frustration of it all!

So after completing the book, and feeling somewhat lost and sad about the fact that, like all good things the book has come to an end, I have realised that I have a huge task ahead of me in terms of "cleaning up my own backyard." Now this is interesting, Kenny, because I don't think that this is something that you can fix overnight. How do you start to sort out your own backyard, things you need to fix within yourself, to get rid of baggage? So we can find out what this essential problem is with ourself...like for Gold, he was always struggling with his ego. This is what I need to find out, and this is my quest for the time being. Ways of achieving this extend to meditating on situations where you have had a particular bad reaction to something, eg experiencing frustration or anger, or even finding out what makes you happy, so that you are indeed finding more out about yourself and your essence. Being mindful of narccissm, of course.

You know one of my favourite quote of Rose's in the book goes something like "All I want to show you is that you are not the egotistical blob of mass that you think you are. You are God." (I don't have my book here, but the quote goes something like that.) Of course this can be misinterpreted by those who don't understand, but really, isn't this about finding and growing into our soul, the absolute that we are longing to go home to?

All I hope is that I have the courage to commit to the truth. It is the only answer and I know that I will never be truly content putting my energy into anything less than this. This is the only game in town.

So thanks very much Kenny, I hope to continue correspondence with you, and if you have any further reading recommendations, please do not hesitate to suggest them.

On a side note, I cannot possibly tell you in this email how humbled and spellbound I was to receive an email from Augie Turak. I cannot believe the path that I have stumbled upon, to be communicating for the first time in my life about something worthwhile such as the search with such incredible people. Augie thanked me for my thoughts that you had shared with others at SKS, and all I want to do is to thank you personally now for breathing life back into my being and holding many of my thoughts in harmony.

Thank you so very much Kenny, and I just must tell you that this is it! Why is there not more of this around?

Universal love,
Betsy

Betsy, I cannot possibly tell you in this email how humbled and spellbound I am each time I receive one of your emails. Some people never think about this stuff, and others think about it all the time. But you're burning with it. Rare and precious.

William James says that everything we do is habit forming; whatever we do once, it becomes easier to do that again. Based on that, he advises that whenever you feel inspired, you immediately *do* something specific: we can develop the habit of always *acting* on our inspirations, or we can develop the opposite habit. So now that you've seen the lofty heights, think about some of the more immediate ways that you can (to use Rose's phrase) "back away from untruth." Cut back on your three-martini-a-day habit, or stop kicking your dog, or meditate for 15 minutes a day, or...whatever. Something very specific, and something that is definitely achievable—not too wildly ambitious—success, too, is a habit.

In the mean time, Kavita suggested that we post all your emails to the Web site. Of course, I would never do such a thing if it makes you uncomfortable...I could post it with your name, or I could post it but leave your name off, or I could not post it at all. What do you think?

-k

Kenny, you know what...I cannot possibly tell you how great it is to finally be doing this. To find the teachings of Richard Rose and to find the Symposium that endorses his teachings, has truly given me hope that I can do what it is that I really want to do. I mean that I can put my energy into something WORTHWHILE! Do you know how great it is to finally find that, Kenny? Such relief! Such hope! Such elation!

Kenny, I appreciate your prompt reply. As for posting the emails on the website, my only worry is how incoherent they are. Because I know that I should re-read them before I send them to you, but for some reason, as soon I write them, I cannot bear to reread what I have written (mmm have to meditate on that one). So I guess, just provided that they are put through some heavy editing, I don't see why there should be a problem. If I could ask, though, that my name be removed from them if they are posted up.

Okay, Kenny, be in close touch, and thanks for the advice about realistic ways to "back away from untruth." Your email was filled with such precious words, Kenny, and it burns right through me each time I try to read it. Recieving your emails is like receiving the one of the most important documents in your life to date (like an exam result). And your emails never fail to disappoint.

Thanks a bundle Kenny!

Betsy

They are not incoherent. Of course I'll do a bit of editing here and there but it will not need much...the passion comes through like a brilliant blue light, and that is what matters.

-k